826 replies to this topic

[harper]

What have you heard from Labour (Scottish or UK) on the strike - they cannot even bring themselves to say they support it?

Salmond needs to steer a very clever route, certain sections of the media (The Scotsman, Telegraph, Evening Stanfdard, The Times) all despise the independence agenda and are doing their damndest to instil baseless fear. Why should he gift them easy targets.

Whether the other parties supported it or not they had an opinion.

If Salmond needs to steer a clever route then maybe talking about something other than independence could be a clever strategy. There are other UK issues that are worth his time, surely?

[Pat]

I got the impression that some MSP's supported the strike:
"Labour MSPs gave up a days' pay to stand on picket lines, despite the position of UK party leader Ed Miliband to neither condemn nor support the strike.

Scottish Labour leader Iain Gray, said: "Thousands of my constituents are public sector workers - they'll be hit by this, asked to pay perhaps as much as £120 more a month and get less in their pension.

"They don't think it's fair and it's the right thing that I should support them"

SNP concluded in their debate inside Holyrood that it was 'a cash grab'

Ten thousand people took to the streets in Glasgow and 7,000 in Edinburgh.
http://www.bbc.co.uk...litics-15938970

I don't think we've heard the last of this issue and doubt this is a single show of industrial action. So there will be future opportunities for everyone to come out and let us see where they stand.

No doubt Salmond has a tricky furrow to plough but I don't think that supporting such a clear case of right against wrong would harm his position or that of Independence. There are an awful lot of teachers, headteachers, nurses, care workers, clerical workers, maintenance staff, and their families, among the electorate.

[samscafeamericain]

Whether the other parties supported it or not they had an opinion.

If Salmond needs to steer a clever route then maybe talking about something other than independence could be a clever strategy. There are other UK issues that are worth his time, surely?

What is it about independence that has you scared?

[harper]

You know my views, I think it was a mistake to delay the referendum and to be honest, I think Salmond has gone off the boil. I think if he is not careful, the global economic crisis will eclipse his campaign and people really will stick with what they know. The election brought home an outstanding result. It seems madness to wait another three years and three years of cuts at that.

[Pat]

Capping people's benefits is disgusting. Good for the clerics and the lords. I usually think that the Lords is an outdated and unnecessary establishment but this government definitely need someone to keep an eye on them.

This latest attempt to cut the benefits bill has not been thought through at all. Many children would suffer and it would hit hardest people in the South with high costs for rental. If they can't pay then they'll become homeless.

Earlier the government defeated a proposed amendment to the bill by Labour to exempt people considered at risk of homelessness from the cap.

http://www.bbc.co.uk...litics-16675314

[samscafeamericain]

Capping people's benefits is disgusting. Good for the clerics and the lords. I usually think that the Lords is an outdated and unnecessary establishment but this government definitely need someone to keep an eye on them.

This latest attempt to cut the benefits bill has not been thought through at all. Many children would suffer and it would hit hardest people in the South with high costs for rental. If they can't pay then they'll become homeless.

Earlier the government defeated a proposed amendment to the bill by Labour to exempt people considered at risk of homelessness from the cap.

http://www.bbc.co.uk...litics-16675314

Capping benefits at £26k per annum (meaning you would need to work and earn £34k per year to be as well off) is clever spin.

[harper]

I think they are tackling this from the wrong angle. The reason the benefit bill is so high is because of the demand for housing pushing up rents in many places. Rents need to be controlled and we need more initiatives like rent deposit schemes. There are thousands of people caught in housing poverty traps. If they started a programme of building more social housing tomorrow to create affordable rented housing, it would be years before the problem was solved. Private landlrds need to be brought under control and rents need to be made more affordable. All that is happening at the moment is that the Government are putting money directly into the pocket of people exploiting the housing market, it doesn't put any more money in the pocket of the person claiming benefits for food, fuel and clothing.

[Pat]

I think they are tackling this from the wrong angle. The reason the benefit bill is so high is because of the demand for housing pushing up rents in many places. Rents need to be controlled and we need more initiatives like rent deposit schemes. There are thousands of people caught in housing poverty traps. If they started a programme of building more social housing tomorrow to create affordable rented housing, it would be years before the problem was solved. Private landlrds need to be brought under control and rents need to be made more affordable. All that is happening at the moment is that the Government are putting money directly into the pocket of people exploiting the housing market, it doesn't put any more money in the pocket of the person claiming benefits for food, fuel and clothing.

Drop Cameron a line, harper. He'd never figure that out.

You make sense but I think that money should also be ploughed into building social housing, apart from helping solve the affordable housing shortage it would create jobs.

Maybe time to move away from thinking only about cuts and growth in the economy.

More and more questions seem to be being asked about the links between economic growth and well being.

http://www.neweconom...l-for-wellbeing

The Happy Planet Index makes very interesting reading -

the UK comes out at 7.8 for life satisfaction, Germany slightly less at 7.4, France 7.1, Greece 6.8, Portugal is 5.8, Cost Rica is 8.5.

http://www.happyplan...l/life-sat.html

I think I'll create a Happy Planet thread.

[harper]

I don't think they should stop building social housing but they can't wait until there is an adequate stock of housing to tackle this problem.

Right, I've had a right grump of a day at work...I'm away to check out the Happy Planet thread ...

[Pat]

I don't think they should stop building social housing but they can't wait until there is an adequate stock of housing to tackle this problem.

Right, I've had a right grump of a day at work...I'm away to check out the Happy Planet thread ...

Someplaces are happier than others but it's not all about great riches.

I know what you meant about the housing stock and agree that there should be controls on rents.

[Pat]

Capping benefits at £26k per annum (meaning you would need to work and earn £34k per year to be as well off) is clever spin.

The benefits cap is set to go ahead and the Welfare Reform Bill introducing the £26,000 cap for workless families was pushed ahead.

So the views of campaigners and the charities have simply been dismissed and the House of Lords are left with little scope for further changes.

Amongst people that are likely to suffer are cancer 7000 cancer sufferers - who haven't recovered quickly enough and disabled children will have payments cut.

The 'bedroom tax' on under-occupied homes, which critics claim will force thousands of council tenants to move. In many cases removing them from their communities and family networks.

Cameron tells us that it's 'right and fair. They're doing a good thing freeing disabled children and many vulnerable adults from the benefits that have 'trapped' them.

We're going to need the poorhooses.

[samscafeamericain]

Compulsary education traps weans until they are 16. Shut down the schools and free those children - are there not chimneys needing swept?

[Pat]

Compulsary education traps weans until they are 16. Shut down the schools and free those children - are there not chimneys needing swept?

Quite, samsc. Just the sort of ideas that could get snapped up.

I read somewhere the other day that now the Citizens Advice Bureaus are in danger of being cut. Think it must have been in the Evening Times.

[Pat]

More bad news from the local councils. Glasgow - Scotland's largest council has to make major cuts in order to save £48.8m between 2013 and 2015. Now it looks as though key services will be hit.

"The Herald understands the council will begin looking for about another 1000 volunteers to take a severance deal in the coming months.

A total of almost 3000 have already left since 2010.

Unions warned more reductions will stretch the workforce to breaking point"
http://www.heraldsco...ign=email+alert

Likely to hit childcare, education and social work with knock on effects for more widespread unemployment and more pressure on other services such as NHS and Prison Services.

Some of the other councils will fare even worse than Glasgow e.g. North Lanarkshire has to find £74 million.

The Commonwealth Games will not be effected. Maybe this should have been cancelled?

[rory]

More bad news from the local councils. Glasgow - Scotland's largest council has to make major cuts in order to save £48.8m between 2013 and 2015. Now it looks as though key services will be hit.

"The Herald understands the council will begin looking for about another 1000 volunteers to take a severance deal in the coming months.

A total of almost 3000 have already left since 2010.

Unions warned more reductions will stretch the workforce to breaking point"
http://www.heraldsco...ign=email+alert

Likely to hit childcare, education and social work with knock on effects for more widespread unemployment and more pressure on other services such as NHS and Prison Services.

Some of the other councils will fare even worse than Glasgow e.g. North Lanarkshire has to find £74 million.

The Commonwealth Games will not be effected. Maybe this should have been cancelled?

The coucil are likely already too far committed to going ahead with the Commonwealth Games but the £15 million to be spent on George Square could be cancelled in order to save jobs.

[Canny Lass]

The coucil are likely already too far committed to going ahead with the Commonwealth Games but the £15 million to be spent on George Square could be cancelled in order to save jobs.

Unlikely to cancel either of these projects because the Councillors like a chance to impress. Might be a good idea to get rid of some of them. Half of them don't seem to do very much. The poverty in Glasgow is appalling and the divide between the rich and the poor growing bigger all the time. Right up the Tories street.

[samscafeamericain]

Unlikely to cancel either of these projects because the Councillors like a chance to impress. Might be a good idea to get rid of some of them. Half of them don't seem to do very much. The poverty in Glasgow is appalling and the divide between the rich and the poor growing bigger all the time. Right up the Tories street.

and yet people will still vote for the status quo when it comes to an independence vote.

[Pat]

Unlikely to cancel either of these projects because the Councillors like a chance to impress. Might be a good idea to get rid of some of them. Half of them don't seem to do very much. The poverty in Glasgow is appalling and the divide between the rich and the poor growing bigger all the time. Right up the Tories street.

Part of the Tory ideology to do away with the public sector.

The Commonwealth Games could attract a fair bit of money into the city and maybe Glasgow will benefit. I hope they learn some lessons from the Olympics and that they'll have learned some lessons - we don't want a giant McDonalds in the complex.

[Pat]

According to Conservative Ramesh Patel, seems that Cameron and Osborne have been telling us a pack of lies about the economy and justification for the cuts:
"After continuously stating the UK had the biggest debt in the world George Osborne admits to the Treasury Select Committee that he did not know the UK had the lowest debt in the G7? Watch: Also, confirmed by the OECD

its laughable to compare UK's debt and deficit with Tuvalu's who only have a GDP/Income of £24 million whilst, the UK's income is £1.7 Trillion.
Finally, Labour in 1997 inherited a debt of 42% of GDP. By the start of the global banking crises 2008 the debt had fallen to 35% - a near 22% reduction page 6 ONS Surprisingly, a debt of 42% was not seen as a major problem and yet at 35% the sky was falling down?"

He also makes it clear that Labour did not cause the deficit - that was down to Global Banking issues.

The third claim that borrowing costs are low because the markets have confidence in George Osborne's austerity plan and without it the UK will end up like Greece." is also rubbish. "The real reason why our borrowing costs have fallen and remained low since 2008 is because, savings have increased"

Patel is calling for Cameron's apology for creating this deficit myth - " the grosses lie ever enforced upon the people".

He's done a great job exposing the lies.
http://www.huffingto...&comm_ref=false

[Canny Lass]

That's a great exposure well done to Patel but did you put this up on the wrong thread, Pat?